You leave the tissue and dead crap in the canal. Ever smell one of these putrid things when you open them up and the tooth is sensitive to hot. You know there is live tissue somewhere.
Guy W. Moorman, Jr., D.D.S.
The Swamp
Douglas, GA 31533
912-384-7400
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From: acesthetics@googlegroups.com [mailto:acesthetics@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken siegel
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 6:00 PM
To: wmdomb@verizon.net
Cc: Mark Malterud; schminsk@bellsouth.net; gnr
Subject: Re: [ACEsthetics] Waveone system
The laser tip never enters the root. It just sends the acoustic wave down the roots from the tip going into the pulp chamber.
Sent from my iPad
On May 27, 2012, at 5:31 PM, "William Domb" <wmdomb@verizon.net> wrote:
Of course that sounds promising, but doesn’t tell me enough to be wholly confident.
As I note, just keeping stuff from growing is a nice but incomplete data point.
Acoustic waves are enough to fracture off chunks of enamel and dentin when using hard tissue lasers, so I’d be naturally concerned, particularly as you get down to the extremely thin and friable apical area.
Minimally invasive: some Europeans are just depositing ozone into the PDL and periapical tissues and not ingressing the tooth internals at all. Now THAT’s minimally invasive. Very little hard data except verbal reports that I can scare up so far.
We need to be looking at the conventional macro parameters of endo success—lack of erythema, edema, mobility, pain, drainage, mobility, etc. AND we need to look at other measure such as CRP, PLAC2, immunomodulation, antigenic percolation and all that good stuff.
regards
bill domb
From: Mark Malterud
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 10:23 AM
Cc: schminsk@bellsouth.net ; gnr
Subject: Re: [ACEsthetics] Waveone system
Bill,
It's not the heat its the acoustic wave from what I can tell and there is research that I will get for you once I have been to Colonnas. They allowed the teeth and inside of the canals to have a very rich C.Dif biofilm and infiltration and then PIPSed the canals and virtually found no living C Dif. upon culturing. It's more of a flush and fill technique as I see it. Very little if any instrumentation so it is about as minimally invasive as you can get when it comes to Endo.
Mark
On May 27, 2012, at 10:26 AM, William Domb wrote:
Hi, John--
We got any research from them? From other than them?
Would be surprised if it truly got all the tubules free of bugs and necrotic debris without being cranked up high enough to do physical damage to root where it gets thin as well as damage to PDL cells.
regards
bill domb
From: John Highsmith DDS
Sent: Sunday, May 27, 2012 4:57 AM
Subject: Re: [ACEsthetics] Waveone system
I've been happy with it so far, but I don't tackle very difficult cases. That's what specialists are for. If it can increase the efficiency and quality of routine endo, then I'm for it.
Also very seriously looking at the PIPS technique using the Lightwalker laser. This concept seems too good to be true! Any ACEers using it?
Here's a link to their site with clinical videos.
In a nutshell, the laser shoots a photoacouistic wave down the canal, so it cleans out all the canal contents including fins and lateral canals, without hogging out the canal the way we usually do to get enough bleach in it. Sounds like you can totally clean and disinfect the entire root canal system without severely weakening the tooth. Cool!
John Highsmith DDS
Clyde, NC
AACD Accredited Dentist
LVI Clinical Instructor
Diplomate, ICOI
Fellow, Misch Implant Institute
DrHighsmith.com
On May 27, 2012, at 7:42 AM, gary l henkel dds wrote:
I’m in agreement with guy on this one. It requires a very large, expensive motor, claims to be a single file system but in actuality multiple files are often required in actual use It has some big names behind its development, so has developed some following, but when I presented with some endodontic community opinion leaders at loma linda recently, representing another manufacturer, many of the hands on participants were not as impressed with it as with several of the other products being offered in the hands on. Having said that, excellent results can be achieved with it, as with all systems, if proper attention to shaping and irrigation and obturation is given. Files only shape. Irrigants disinfect. Fill systems or protocols obturate. All are important for long term endodontic success.
But guy, you and I have been doing endo long enough that we both know that you cannot treat ALL teeth with rotaries, regardless of manufacturer. Sometimes, judicious use of hand instrumentation gives us our best chance in highly curved or deeply split cases. That’s why having a couple of alternative “systems” in office and combine that with good training and clinical experience gives us the best chance of success.
gary
Gary L. Henkel DDS MAGD
Horsham Dental Elements ( Pine Run Dental and Implant Center)
301 Horsham Rd
Horsham, Pa. 19044
2156726666
Philadelphia Center City Office
1601 Walnut St. Suite 1501
Philadelphia, Pa. 19102
215 5639769
From: acesthetics@googlegroups.com [mailto:acesthetics@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Ken siegel
Sent: Saturday, May 26, 2012 10:23 PM
To: toothpick44@gmail.com
Cc: acesthetics@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: [ACEsthetics] Waveone system
Im still liking. The system
Ken Siegel
-------- Original message --------
Subject: Re: [ACEsthetics] Waveone system
From: Guy Moorman <toothpick44@gmail.com>
To: Ken siegel <kensiegel@onlymyemail.com>
CC: Re: [ACEsthetics] Waveone systemUnusual. This system's main advantage is a small number of files and reciprocation reducing risk to some degree. It will not adequately do many teeth, especially truly calcified molars. This is stated straight up by developers of the system. I've used the system on a fair number of teeth and find it lacking compared to true rotary systems like Protapers and Twisted Files finishing with a landed file like the K3. It simply will not adequately do all teeth. Rotary will. I fail to see the point in purchasing it in place of a good rotary system. Brassler has a new system but I find the files frail. Guy
On Apr 26, 2012 2:02 PM, "Ken siegel" <kensiegel@onlymyemail.com> wrote:
I know there was some discussion about the wave one endo system a little while ago. The people on the Lightwalker Laser forum had recommended it so I finally bought the system. From the few end's that I have done with it I will have to say that it is really terrific. I just did an endo on #30 that was calcified as hell. The Waveone system handled the canals like a champ. I really would have been afraid to take a traditional NiTi file down the canals but it was a real pleasure. So anyone who is thinking about the system I have to say I am very pleased.
Ken
Kenneth Siegel, D.M.D.
Dental Excellence of Blue Bell
706 Dekalb Pike
Blue Bell, Pa. 19422
610-272-4319 fax
215-498-5991 cell
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