As you have mentioned following conditions must be met to sort out our problems:
(a) Will power and conviction to apply rules.
(b)People must change mindset.
(c)Introduce comprehensive electoral and judicial reforms.
It is further stated that none of the above are feasible as leadership is lacking.
It implies that for all practical purposes we are doomed.
We have had remarkable leaders and dedicated people. Where have they all gone.? Indians do badly in India but excel abroad. How do we explain this if we lack leadership.
It all boils down to is we have landed up with poor system of governance which is not suitable for India. If we can workout and implement appropriate system, India will take off in a short time.
Regards,
Satish
On Thursday, 19 December 2013, 18:43, Radha Mohan <radhamohan@ibsindia.org> wrote:
As Mr. Tarun Das said that we have enough systems and mechanisms to deal with the menace of corruption and we lack is only the will-power and conviction to apply them. Unless the people's mindset changes nothing could save the systemic crises as we see today and there is nothing to celebrate at this juncture..at the same time more comprehensive reform of electoral system has to be done along with judicial reforms on other fronts. But to achieve all these things nothing could help us other than a 'strong leadership' which is lacking in the country today.
On Thu, Dec 19, 2013 at 3:52 PM, Satish Oberoi <oberoi50@yahoo.com> wrote:
We all wish that things will be fine after the Lokpal bill.Past experience tells us that agencies Lokpal or any other setup is likely to create one more layer of corruption. There is a suggestion that teachers must play their role as education is most important source of inculcation morality and values. Even if we are to find good teachers, they have to work within confines of system over which they have no control. Only answer, we must have multi pronged self cleaning system which will simultaneously work at different levels. Unless we can do this we cannot expect anything remarkable.Regards,Satish
On Thursday, 19 December 2013, 15:26, Virendra Goel <goel.virendra@gmail.com> wrote:
--Dear Dr. Das,My own realization is that what we teach at the school has to be reinforced at home and in the society and what is happening is just contrary to that and I see that as a real problem. I agree that no amount of law and punishment can eliminate the evil. Only thing that has worked in the past, working now, and will be working in the future is social pressure. No man would like to be socially isolated and he would do anything for that. You can see the example in Sikh community – a man like Buta Singh had to go to Gurudwara and do kar sewa to get rid of title of 'Tankhaiya' that would throw him out of the community. You can see the same effect of Fatwas in muslim community.RegardsVirendra GoelFrom: Tarun Das [mailto:das.tarun@hotmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 12:48 PM
To: Virendra Goel; A N Bhattacharya; MTC Global
Cc: Prof. Bholanath Dutta; Benita Sharma
Subject: RE: [MTC Global] Lokpal Bill and Anna
Dear Professor Goel- I congratulate you for your noble efforts and request you to continue with your system and advise others to follow that. I am confident that your efforts are not futile and cannot remain unrewarded for a long time. The problem is that the system does not exist in every school and college. As a result, when your students face the real world they become uncompetitive in a world of unfair and dishonest practices. They say that you have to become mad for survival in a mad world. That's the pathetic situation we face today in our society. Even then I am advocating for introducing your system in each and every school, college, educational institute and in each family. Then you see the difference.
Dr. Tarun DasFrom: goel.virendra@gmail.com
To: das.tarun@hotmail.com; bhatta_2001@sify.com; join_mtc@googlegroups.com
CC: bnath.dutta@gmail.com; sharma.benita@gmail.com
Subject: RE: [MTC Global] Lokpal Bill and Anna
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2013 12:08:33 +0530As far as changing the mindset of education through education is concerned. I feel this exercise will be futile unless a child and a young man has same kind of experience at school, at home and in the society. I have been associated with school education for more than 30 years and we have been practicing EHV (Education in Human Values) with a 20 minute period every day in a well-structured experience in five values i.e. Righteousness, Truth, Love, Non-violence and peace and five mediums i.e. silent sitting, group singing, role play, storytelling and group activities. My observation is that with this input of 14(yrs.)x211(working days of school)x20 minutes in addition to a 8 days summer camp and two annual visits for seva activities to which every student is exposed, there is hardly any marked difference in the personality of our outgoing student in comparison to other school where there is no such practice.I tried it in the management school also where I was Chairman and students simply make mockery of the whole thing. A simple process of chanting 'OM' thrice that will bring the order in the class and which took only 30 seconds was not done seriously.RegardsVirendra GoelFrom: Tarun Das [mailto:das.tarun@hotmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 11:43 AM
To: Virendra Goel; A N Bhattacharya; MTC Global
Cc: Prof. Bholanath Dutta; Benita Sharma
Subject: RE: [MTC Global] Lokpal Bill and Anna
I am sorry to say that Professor Goel has not understood my basic message. To professor Goel, my simple questions are- What is the root cause of corruptions? If all of us, except politicians, are honest and guided by moral and ethical values (as it is being claimed by many in the media, press, internet including all of us in this Forum) then why do we need a Lok Pal or RTI? So, we need not blame only the politicians.As I have said earlier, the basic problem is that there is corruption in every field of professions- public servants, politicians, corporate bodies, doctors, engineers, managers, teachers, professors, lawyers, law makers and other experts. So we need to attack at the basic root and change of the mind set of all citizens through reforms in basic and higher education. Let all the teachers and parents teach all the students and young boys and girls to have moral and ethical values in life and profession and not to become money making machines and run after materialistic and financial gains by any means. If that happens, I do not think that there is need for any Lok Pal.
Dr. Tarun Das
From: goel.virendra@gmail.com
To: das.tarun@hotmail.com; bhatta_2001@sify.com; join_mtc@googlegroups.com
CC: bnath.dutta@gmail.com; sharma.benita@gmail.com
Subject: RE: [MTC Global] Lokpal Bill and Anna
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2013 11:03:00 +0530I think we have a reason to rejoice. And the reason is humbling of the politicians by the citizens. These narcissist claimed that elected representative were supreme in democracy and not the electors (Mulayam Singh again said the same thing in Lok Sabha yesterday) – Janlokpal movement and success of 'AAP' in Delhi Election has shown them their place in democracy.AS regards to utility of LOK PAL – well despite all manipulations, RTI has definitely empowered the common citizen to some extent and I am sure Lokpal will also somewhere make a dent in corruption at higher level. We can look forward to more activism to contain the corruption.RegardsVirendra GoelFrom: Tarun Das [mailto:das.tarun@hotmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2013 10:09 AM
To: A N Bhattacharya; MTC Global
Cc: Virendra Goel; Prof. Bholanath Dutta; Benita Sharma
Subject: RE: [MTC Global] Lokpal Bill and AnnaThere is nothing to rejoice. At present we have no dearth of institutions ans laws to deal with corruption such as CBI, CVC, Police, Consumer Courts, Civil, Criminal and other Judicial Courts, Gram Panchayats, Citizens Charter and Grievance Redress Cells in every government and corporate organizations. The basic problem is with its implementation, because we have a very few committed, dedicated, sincere and honest persons to run these organizations. So my basic question is- where from the Lok Pals will come? From the moon or from another planet? I am sure that after a few years we need Jana Lok Pals to watch Lok Pals, followed by Jana Gana Lok Pals to watch both Lok Pals and Jana Lok Pals, and then Jana Gana Mana Lok Pals to keep an eye on every body. Unless we change the mind set of our people and bring a drastic change of our education system starting from the very beginning focusing on ethical and moral values rather than simply producing management, legal, medical, engineering and other professional experts with profound knowledge and expertise of how to make more money by hook and crooks, we cannot wipe out corruption from our society.
Dr. Tarun DasWorld Bank Technical Adviser (Public Debt Management and Policy)Deepening Medium Term Budget Framework & Strengthening Financial Accountability ProjectMinistry of Finance, Government of Bangladesh, Dhaka-1200.Subject: Re: [MTC Global] Lokpal Bill and Anna
To: join_mtc@googlegroups.com
CC: goel.virendra@gmail.com; bnath.dutta@gmail.com; das.tarun@hotmail.com
From: bhatta_2001@sify.com
Date: Thu, 19 Dec 2013 02:55:05 +0000
I am surprised! Can we say with conviction that this half-hearted attempt at the Lokpal by Congress and BJP was on account of genuine intent of these parties? Had it been so, these parties with 'wise' men would not have waited so long. Also see what these buffoons are doing with RTI. The political parties would be out of its purview. They are the most corrupt.
At least we should be able to see through the malicious intent behind congress-bjp accepting a strip down Lokpal.
Anna is great, but to make India Great, we need Great Indians to run this country. Activism can at best act as 'watch dogs' or 'conscous keepers'.
ANBhattacharyaSent from my BlackBerry® smartphone from !DEA
From: "Prabhakar Waghodekar" <waghodekar@rediffmail.com>Sender: join_mtc@googlegroups.comDate: 18 Dec 2013 19:47:08 -0000Subject: [MTC Global] Lokpal Bill and AnnaDear All,Anna has made a unique impression on the History of India: He is responsible for RTI and Lokpal Bill. We need to admit that wisdom, reason, purity of mind, focused approach, determination and above all self-less service to the nation always prevails over any political game!All power politics, muscle power, political strength or backing, money power, ability to gather public, so called leadership qualities, education, type of employment, political jugglery, etc., have proved inferior, defeated.My salute to Anna, a typical Indian 'dehati' and ex-serviceman with abundant wisdom!!Long live Anna!
Regards,
Dr P H Waghodekar
Advisor (HR), IBS & PME (PG)
Marathwada Institute of Technology,
Aurangabad: 431028 (Maharashtra) INDIA.
(O) 02402375113 (M) 7276661925
E-Mail: waghodekar@rediffmail.com
Website: www.mit.asia
Engineering & Management Education: An Engine of Prosperity.
Classroom teaching must match with Boardroom needs!
From: "Prof. Bholanath Dutta"
Sent: Wed, 18 Dec 2013 19:50:48
To: join_mtc <join_mtc@googlegroups.com>
Subject: [MTC Global] Lokpal Bill clears Lok Sabha test; Anna Hazare ends fast, nation celebratesLokpal Bill clears Lok Sabha test; Anna Hazare ends fast, nation celebrates
People have to be vigilant. Only then will they benefit from this law," says Anna Hazare minutes before ending his fast. Anna also suggests creating a watchdog to check corruption.
"We want to form committees of retired judges, top cops to suggest and monitor the implementation of Lokpal. Only a law will not help. We have to see how the Lokpal is implemented. Thank the media for playing its role as a strong fourth pillar that is necessary for any democracy. Lokpal must now become a law before the Lok Sabha polls," says Anna Hazare while addressing a press conference at Ralegan Siddhi.
EDUCATE, EMPOWER, ELEVATEProf. Bholanath DuttaFounder, President & ConvenerMTC Global: ISO 9001: 2008 CertifiedParticipant: United Nations Global Compact
Website: www.mtcglobal.org/ www.knowledgecafe.orgpresident@mtcglobal.org');" target="_blank" >president@mtcglobal.org / president@knowledgecafe.orgCell: +91 96323 18178
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